[Closed] new bike ....pipedream

Looks good, but Im suprised that a wooden gate can support the weight of a Pipedream Sirius

davidtaylforth - Member

Looks good, but Im suprised that a wooden gate can support the weight of a Pipedream Sirius

heh.

Looks cwap 🙂

I've got an older one and love it.

[url= http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1074/877482852_2b23fd6efa.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1074/877482852_2b23fd6efa.jp g"/> [/img][/url] [url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/think180/877482852/ ]IMG_0289[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/think180/ ]simoncarter.es[/url], on Flickr

Enjoy, you won't be disappointed.

Looks good, but Im suprised that a wooden gate can support the weight of a Pipedream Sirius

you can't beat a good steel hardtail, i like that, less showroom bling and more practical riding parts, very unusual on this forum

I love mine too, although I've gone down the rigid route. I think that the weight thing is overplayed a bit too, they're not the lighest frames around but they are CEN tested and plenty tough enough. In the recent WMB steel hardtail test (which the Pipedream won) I think that the Sirius was the lighest on test (although I'd have to check to be sure), lighter even than the Cove Handjob (although a weight comparision between the Sirius and the likes of a BFe and Blue Pig probably isn't very meaningful).

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@CheesybeanZ: I couldn't decide between the green and the black until now. Yours looks great; its an understated beauty and I now have a black frame on its way to me 🙂

Interestingly Pipedream are now promoting their forthcoming [url= http://www.pipedreamcycles.com/scion_2010.html ]R853 Scion[/url] which seems to be a lighter, fixed dropout version of the Sirius. I can't see any indication as to whether the Scion will be CEN tested (the Sirius was originally not going to be but ended up being CEN tested). It looks interesting but I'm happy with my Sirius.

@ PJay, what's the fork?

It's an Orange F8 steel fork. Although the F8 is officially only available in black, if you ask nicely they'll paint you up one free of charge using one of their custom frame colour options (mine's Kermit Green which isn't exactly the same as Pipedream's Kawasaki green, but close enough). There may be a bit of a delay depending on what colour the paintshop is currently using.

Pipedream do their own [url=

fork[/url] but they're only available in black or white (fine if you have a black frame), it's a shame they didn't do a batch in colours to match the Sirius.

Thanks, I'm thinking about rebuilding mine as a rigid SSer for the winter.

Hijack, Don Simon, I've got a Surly rigid fork for sale only 4or 5 rides use! Email in addy if you'd like more info.

Well they've gone back to 16mm seat stays on the Scion, where the new Sirius has 19mm stays. I approve, but need the sliding rear end and green paintjob for my life to be complete 😀

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I've ordered a Sirius but since then have spent 48hrs trying to contact them to change this to a Scion. Anyone know how to get Pipedream to answer a call, return a voicemail or reply to an email?

26lbs complete is very good - is it a 19.5''

Mine is SS guise with reasonably lightweight parts is a smidge over 24lbs

[img] [/img]

I'm spending too long looking at pics on here. Those top three with the gears look a bit odd, took me a while to realise why! The other two look more normal...

@andrewh. Is it just the gears or something more subtle?

Those top three with the gears look a bit odd, took me a while to realise why!

okay , what have i done wrong with the build ?????

I've had no problems getting hold of the chaps at Pipedream by email, or for that matter leaving a voice mail but they seem to be a fairly small setup (and sometimes out riding) so do persevere. They've always got back to me, but sometimes it can take a while.

The Scion does look interesting but I'm really happy with my Sirius.

Can someone tell me what the difference between the scion and normal siruis is

is it just lighter?

What benefit is

Cowled dropouts with replaceable hanger

As far as I can see it's just going to be a little lighter. I think that they've gone back to 16mm chainstays from the 19mm on the Sirius but I don't know whether that will make for a more compliant ride; my Sirius is plenty comfy. I supose that if, like me, you're only going to run a geared set up the sliding dropouts aren't a major selling point, although I think that they're Paragon Machine Works droupouts which give you the option of geared, singlespeed, Roholf or Maxle droupout which make the Sirius a pretty versitile frame; I'd guess that losing the sliding dropout probably saves a bit of cost too. The Scion also appears to only have bottle cage boses on the downtube.

I get the feeling that the Scion is a bit of a response to some critism of the CEN testing changes uping the weight of the Sirius somewhat, although I don't have a problem with the weight of my 19.5".

@ op, hope it rides as good as it looks.

I never had problems getting replies from Pipedream, most were answered on a Sunday, which I was very impressed with.
Thanks for the offer tollah, but postage to Spain would probably kill and joy of cheapness. 😉

I've ordered a Sirius but since then have spent 48hrs trying to contact them to change this to a Scion...

They emailed and called me today - the delay was illness related so I feel a bit bad about my moan earlier.

Anyway, the Scion won't be available until mid-January. They'll be confirming weights at about the same time.

@CheesybeanZ - how does it ride? Did you work out why [b]andrewh[/b] thinks your bike looks, erm, "a bit odd"?

PJay - Member

"Interestingly Pipedream are now promoting their forthcoming R853 Scion which seems to be a lighter, fixed dropout version of the Sirius. I can't see any indication as to whether the Scion will be CEN tested (the Sirius was originally not going to be but ended up being CEN tested)."

Sounds like they might be correcting the mistakes of the Sirius- it was designed without consideration of CEN then bodged into compliance at the last minute which is why it's so overweight for an 853 XC frame. They walked into it to be honest with their head-in-the-sand approach to the testing but it's still a shame to see a good company take a hit like that.

Sounds like they might be correcting the mistakes of the Sirius...

All they have changed is the dropouts, seatstays, lost one set of bottle cage bosses and introduced a horrible blue paint job. If the Sirius was that wrong surely it would take more than the above to fix it?

I'm struggling with these claimed weights TBH.

I've got an SS T1456 thats 23lbs, and it can't really get much lighter without being silly.

very nice and understated. I always fancied the brewmaster because it contained string and glue, but you can't go wrong with a nice steel frame.

Been riding mine for a while now and I love it. Great fun, especially on singletrack. Nice and comfy. Versatile. Takes a battering. Cheap (for what it is)

Seems 'quite light' to me (not that I really care that much). Don't think there's owt else on the market I'd want to swap it for.

Gratuitous pic (actually being ridden!):

[img] [/img]

el_boufador, how did you master the 'pissed, falling back against that tree on my back wheel with my lights puking out all their light in one go' look? 🙂

Edit. Seriously, how did the lights come out like that but you and bike are fine?

many years of practice

I'm struggling with these claimed weights TBH.

Snap, they seem to build up lighter than Soul's, but weight's not everything I guess.

I'm not sure where all this 'correcting the mistakes ...', bodged CEN compliance and seriously overweight comes from. I didn't weigh my frame (19.5") but the overall build weight didn't seem much different to my 853 Inbred build (the kit was transfered across), it certainly doesn't feel any heavier to ride or, for that matter, slower or less comfty. In the WMB grouptest, which the Sirius won it was also the lighest build; I appreciate that magazine articles are hardly definitive but the bikes were given a serious test by competent individuals and they certainly didn't seem to complain.

CEN compliance was a suprise, when I pre-ordered my frame in December the Sirius wasn't going to be CEN tested, the frame that arrived many months later (after some long delays, the original ETA was December) the frame had been CEN tested and was, no doubt, a bit heavier as a result; I'm no expert but I can't see, or more to the point, feel when riding, anything that suggests that it's a bodge (nor in fact did the WTM team),the ride seems just as nice as my non-CEN 853 Inbred. My main gripe was the Pipedream didn't inform me of the changes that were being made after my pre-order had be placed.

If I was buying again I'd probably go for the Scion, I don't need sliding dropout and a little less weight in a frame that's not going to be running 130mm fork and getting thrashed is probably a good thing and narrower chainstays might at a bit extra compliance (although the Sirius is a very comfy ride), but I'm really pleased with my Sirius.

pastcaring - Member
@ op, hope it rides as good as it looks

rides great feels more springy than my old Inbred , its now got RS revs at 125mm and feels great . just had a week riding in Innerleithen mix of trail centre and natural stuff with no probs . the sliding drop outs are good for ss with no need for a ugly tensioner .

Just about finished building up a MK1 frame and looking forward to riding it. No idea the difference in ride between the new and the old but i do like the skinnyness looks of the MK1. Built up with an old pair of Pace RC36's and it's got a nice blend of old school, new look about it.

I don't think that is much heavier than many other CEN compliant hardtails of this type, but its rather heavier than they originally claimed it would be. I for one, was looking for a lighter steel trail bike, rather than a heavier one, and, had I commited, I would have been rather pee'd off with them.

For all you Pipedream owners, Bikeradar posted a very positive review recently:

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/bikes/mountain/product/sirius-custom-10-39838

They didn't give a flying fark about the weight and neither should you.

OK, I think I probably got carried away there, you're probably right and they actually haven't fixed the mistakes of the Sirius. Hoping for too much there maybe.

Right, my new 18" Sirius frame arrives tomorrow. I'll have the apparently lardy thing on the scales and a pic on here over the weekend.

I think I'll be well up for one of the Scion frames next year.

Been thinking sbout a Sirius for a while but the sliding dropouts arent for me.

New 18" Sirius frame has arrived today and here are the weights:

Frame = 2.333kg (5.143lbs)
Sliders, bolts and screws = 178g (0.392lbs)
Total = 2.511kg (5.535lbs)(Claimed total = 2.46 kg/5.4lbs).

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That weight seems reasonable for a steel frame with sliders.

How do maufacturers get away with this whole "claimed weight" scam anyway?? It is always well below the actual weight. All they have to do is put their product on a scale as you have done and then give us the real figures. It seems to be accepted that official weight figures are basically lies - it's high time manufacturers started being honest about weights.

packer - Member

"That weight seems reasonable for a steel frame with sliders."

It's not bad, [i]unless[/i] it's made of 853. Fair enough the sliders do add weight but tbh even if you remove that weight entirely it's still overweight for an 853 XC frame warrantied for only 130mm. Fair enough a Soul's over £100 more expensive but that's the benchmark and it's a pound lighter, and warrantied for more fork to boot.

Mine is the same as markinoxon's. 18", 5.5 lb.

Northwind - that's exactly what I thought when mine arrived. I toyed with selling it on. I am very, very glad I didn't.

We seem to be getting very hung up about the weight of the Sirius as if that's the only thing that matters. WMB clearly weren't that bothered and neither am I; mine rides really nicely regardless. Any extra weight certainly doesn't seem to affect things adversely from my perspective and it may well add a bit of extra strength and durability. I guess that it's down to the individuals and what they want from a frame but I'm happy with mine.

lets be honest how many of us can feel a bit of extra weight when were on our favourite bit of single track or sliding around in the mud .
anyone getting a Sirius isnt buying an xc race bike , its a great trail bike that can run gears , single speed or even take a set of 650Bs if you felt the urge . its a great bike dont get stuck on one small point .

PJay - Member

"We seem to be getting very hung up about the weight of the Sirius as if that's the only thing that matters."

Mmm, maybe. It's just the bit they got wrong, is all. The fact is you pay for an 853 frame but you don't get all the benefits. If they'd got it right, they could have got the same handling and lost the lard, or use a cheaper tubeset and saved you a few pennies, think we can all agree that'd be a good thing no? And it's not because of bad design, Pipedream know their stuff, it's because of bad management and planning.

Certainly doesn't make it a bad frame, just not as good as it should have been. It doesn't take anything away from the stuff they got right, which tbh is why I think it's such a shame. if it was a rotten frame and overweight, who'd care?

Of course you get all the benefits, the added weight comes from the 4130 sections making it marginally heavier than the Soul at 5lbs, which isn't too unreasonable considering it rides better than a Soul (more direct, better handling) and is cheaper than a Soul. I certainly wouldn't pay the extra for a Soul. If it wasn't for the extra beef you actually wouldn't have the ride quality you've got with it. And any pandering to the "not light weight" wrap it got, Pipedream are just responding to what people want with their "rider driven philosophy" - I'm not sure that's a smart move with the proposed 'Scion' to be honest (if it ever arrives)

As for forks, Stuart rides his with a 140mm fork, as do I and wouldn't dream of running it any different (if I did I'd fall over the front). All in all, a very versatile and capable frame with some very appealing qualities indeed, and builds up into a cracking ride with the right bits on it....and I wouldn't shell out the extra for a Soul unless I actually preferred the end product (which I don't) and needed the small weight saving.

I will say this though, it was more luck than judgement that they ended up with the product they got.

17.5" Soul is 4.4 lbs according to Si, so at 5.5 lbs the 18" Sirius is quite a large percentage heavier.

You see the weight above (5.1), mine's a medium at 5.0.

The trouble with the first batch of Sirius frames is the weight on some of them (ie, not the majority) was all over the place. I'm not even sure that first production run should have shipped, but that's just my opinion.

But the 17.5" Soul is £470 no? (luckily?) I pre-ordered but I'm getting a more versatile, just as capable frame for £250. The Soul is still quite a large percentage more expensive.

billbixby: "As for forks, Stuart rides his with a 140mm fork, as do I and wouldn't dream of running it any different (if I did I'd fall over the front)"

So the handling is brilliant but you need to run it with a fork longer than it's designed for, warrantied for, or could pass the CEN testing with?

The Soul (and most 853 frames) has cro-mo components too so that doesn't explain the weight difference. (I'm not aware of anyone using the 853 stays, there probably is someone though)

"If it wasn't for the extra beef you actually wouldn't have the ride quality you've got with it."

Sorry but that's just making excuses. How does the weight improve the ride quality?

My post and photo above about my lovely new frame's weight was for info rather than a moan.

I weigh around thirteen and a half stone - about a stone of that is spare. Even if this great frame were a pound over weight, I doubt the average 'carrying a few pounds' trail rider with average ability would even notice.

If the ride of my good looking, great handling bike is ruined by one pound I'll just take my morning constitutional before setting off. 🙂

My post and photo above about my lovely new frame's weight was for info rather than a moan.

Agreed. The folk [i]still[/i] moaning about the weight don't seem to have ridden one.

Yes, it is heavier than it could be and yes it is heavier than some of the competition.

No, I don't care (any more).

So the handling is brilliant but you need to run it with a fork longer than it's designed for, warrantied for, or could pass the CEN testing with?

Handling is outstanding and it's personal preference. I prefer to run mine at 140, a lot I would imagine going off that WMB review choose to run it at 120, or lower - not for me though, thanks. Just doesn't do it for me. I did say it was versatile. I have no idea whether it was CEN tested at 140 and don't really care.

The Soul (and most 853 frames) has cro-mo components too so that doesn't explain the weight difference. (I'm not aware of anyone using the 853 stays, there probably is someone though)

The small weight addition is what it is, and from what I can tell is in the double S bends - it works for that particular design. I tend to think that's where the "more luck than judgement" comes in.

Sorry but that's just making excuses. How does the weight improve the ride quality?

The added weight works in the designs favour firming up the back end just enough without ruining the ride. The balance it struck was just right, like I said, I suspect more luck than judgement involved.

And I've ridden both, I doubt you have.

I've ridden one of the first run- I was half thinking of buying one based on their original claimed weight and pre-order price before the redesign, to build up as a rigid. It was OK, prefer my Soul for its agility and balance but it wasn't bad at all, it just didn't fit the bill in the end.

"The added weight works in the designs favour firming up the back end just enough"

The rear end's pretty much the same in feel as my Soul. And it's made out of the same material, they've both got cromo rear ends. So that's not where the excess weight lives. Also the non-CEN version had the same shaped rear end but not the weight.

Don't misunderstand me here, I think it's a nice enough frame and a better option than Inbreds etc despite the weight and the poor design decisions.

But people insist on excusing or even justifying the weight- I've no beef with anyone who says "Sure, it's a bit heavy but it rides well and I like it", that's what I said of my Idrive- but if you find yourself resorting to totally spurious justification rather than being realistic about it then that should tell you something, no?

Don't try and make an asset of it when it's no such thing, or excuse it with false explanations, just be realistic about it and say it's an excellent but flawed design that you still think stands on its merits despite its flaws. Simple.

Except it's a completely different rear end design to the Soul. They also changed tube diameter and wall thickness, so yes, that is where the bulk of the so called 'excess' went.

You're just another full of it Soul rider.

"Except it's a completely different rear end design to the Soul. "

Of course it is, but it's functionally comparable and made of the same materials. If it's much heavier to do the same job then that speaks for itself.

(FWIW I'm only a Soul rider just now because I'm waiting for a replacement Mmmbop, I like it a lot but I'm no fanboi. But it's the benchmark for a mid-travel 853 hardtail so it's where you've got to make the comparison, and it's very obvious where it fails to measure up, and why, and where it stands on merit and competes. What they got right, they got very right, and what they got wrong they've been very open about which is great)

The Pipedream I have isn't what I would call heavy and I would be happy to do a 75km+ race with it.
Racing specific duties go to the Orbea Alma.
The Sirius is a great frame for the money, great fun and who cares about the weight. The Recons weigh a good kilo more that the fork on the Alma. A lightweight frame is going to be something less than 1,5kg and cost considerably more.

Enjoy it, they're ace.

I ride an older soul, and my riding mate has a new sirus, and we both run reba's at 120mm. Having ridden them side by side on a couple of occasions I really couldn't tell the difference, other than the contact points, and to me both a pretty nifty bikes if you like steel hardtails. I stand amazed at how some people are able to isolate such great difference between frames of the same material given all the variables, and whilst hammering it through the local woods etc. There is quite a bit of the emperor's new clothes in bikes, it helps us all to justify our spends, but some folk need to get a grip.

If you're a weight weenie - worry about it.
If you're not - just get out and ride.

But having said that - there is a significant difference in weight between the Soul and I would wonder where that extra metal is and how it affects the ride. Somebody's said no difference in ride, but it looks like something between half to a whole pound difference. That's got to affect the ride.

You increase the tube diameter and wall thickness (all more metal) add those sliding drop-outs and increase head tube thickness and it all adds up. Yet the added weight gives the new Sirius a better poise and control over the old (considerably lighter) one, it just feels 'right'.

Soul probably is a "benchmark weight", but certainly not ride as far as I'm concerned. I can think of a couple of steel frames I'd go for over a Soul.

If you're a weight weenie - [s]worry about it[/s] buy something carbon.
If you're not - just get out and ride.

😀

On another note - Pjay would that have you on your green Pipedream that we saw in Glasto/Street today??

Clink,

Yes I expect that was me (unless there are two), on my way back from a tootle to Wells.

I'm happy with my Sirius 853, like many of us I have a shitload of weight to loose off my frame before I give a crap what a bike frame weighs.