Rumour has it that the Duke of Bedford estates are unhappy about the trails built in Apsley Woods and are making noises about haing it closed down. I assume closed as in by Mr Bulldozer?

ye gods man is this true?? By trails do you mean the jumps and downhill area or the whole shebang? it's really starting to take shape as well….been riding there for 20 years so i'll be right gutted along with many others.

Well the MTB precence has increased there over last couple of years and I thought we were getting away with it, but it appears some of it has been a bit too much 'in your face' for other users and that has clearly come to light at the users forums.

This is true things have got much much more developed there in the last few years..be a huge shame if they do close though as there's bugger all else round here!

this will be bad bad news if true. can't imagine not having access to woburn. hope the duke sees sense.

Wer'e trying to get something together to present to the estate, but it's early days.
There's no question of shutting all access down ROWs will remain ROWs.
The problem is it's private land and although there are user meetings the MTB fraternity is poorly represented, so the estate is really only hearing one side of the arguement.
The wardens are on our side so is the South Beds council cycling rep.
Edit;
There's big support from this end i.e Leighton Buzzard after it became a cycling town. The reps are working hard to develop the sport in the area with Go-Ride events etc.
It would be interesting to see if any of the biking businesses that run out of Woburn have been told anything.?

Any cousins of the Duke on here old boy to launch an appeal?

Very sad news if thats true. I've also been riding there on and off since the 1980's.

I have an odd view of the situation. As a man who some times goes for a family dog walk, last Sunday afternoon for example I hardly ever see bikes and have never had a problem with irresponsible riding, not even people going a bit too fast

But when I'm on my bike I'm very aware of just how many trails there are now and just how busy its getting. Saturday of course was mad because of the Evan's ride it, maybe that pushed some ones patience. Its the only time it looked really busy to me…

I have wondered whether its really suffered from the Internet. I think its just a good spot for such a large area that the internet has brought in more and more people. Shame it can't have a media blackout….

Not that that would be possible

PS when I'm on my bike I make comedy huge efforts to be friendly to other trail users,,,,,

what can people do to support the case for mtb-ers?

Well we've got what's the closest to a Diplomat working on it 😐

i wonder if there is another motive behind this….a couple of years ago there was talk of a centre parcs to be built in the area??

I think that a well thought out and pragmatic proposal would be in everyones interest though, as they have been grumbling about bikers for many a year.

Perhaps by properly waymarking the ridable trails this would stop people from using unauthorised sections (as i have done many times!!) and keep some order in the woods?

The Center Parcs was to be built some way from Woburn.

Your other point can be worked on. I don't think it would be that hard to create trails that run paralel to existing ROWs which is what's happened in many cases anyway.
The other thing that we think is a problem is concern over man made obstacles. The fear is that an acident on a bit of shore would be a court case waiting to happen. Hence bit of shore disapear PDQ but cut trails stay.

This seems to be a recurant issue now adays esp down south.

Hardly a week has gone by this year with out a thread saying such and such an area is too busy.

Either people are building unauthorized jumps on the Surrey Hills or the trails are unusable at swinley over winter because there's so many riders. Or people are daring to use halfords own brand bikes at cannock and are generally getting in the way.

The problem is if one area were to now close ie Woburn it would surely start to put massive pressure on the other areas too.

Im sure Chicksands and Swinley would get more busy if Woburn were shut.

How would they actually prevent people riding there?

I guess the obvious way to solve the problem would be to make a "dedicated trail" such as follow the dog at Cannock which could weave it's way around the woods on it's own course and not interfere with other users and the larger bridal ways, it would no doubt limit the freedom we have had but like all things now it's all about regulation and control.
Of course this means money and time so i dont rate our chances.

jase they couldn't really, but it would be like it was twenty years ago i.e we don't mind you being here but keep a low profile.
What they could do is fence off areas of plantation so you couldn't get to the cheeky trails and they could slap up plenty of No Cycling signs as well as heavily enforce the permit system.

I think also that a lot of riders who go there are not getting permits , obviously any observer can see its busy there and doesn't match the permit holders levels, so this may smart a bit financially. I may be wrong on this as i am not 100% sure if you still need permits but i know you used to in the past.

(hands up though the few times i've ridden there i didn't have one)

May help if the mtb folks started to get permits as a rise in income is always a bit of an encouragement.

You do need a permit as i was asked for mine on Sunday by a ranger…and for the first time in ages i had one. you have to download a form from here http://www.greensandtrust.org/permits.html

they are ridiculously cheap too. there's no excuse for not having one. saying that if they don't check people for them then i can see why people don't bother getting them in the first place. i've been checked once since 2005.

Igot without a permit a few years back. I felt bad and coughed up £2.

Been a memeber ever since. It is so cheap

I went through the play area last summer it was very busy so the warden came down to check permits. I was the only rider withy one and I only pass through.
I felt ashamed of the abuse he got from the other bikers. No one coughed up for a day permit and either ignored him, rode off or gave him verbal.
I felt compelled to stay and talk to him after that and smooth things over.

I went through the play area last summer it was very busy so the warden came down to check permits. I was the only rider withy one and I only pass through.
I felt ashamed of the abuse he got from the other bikers. No one coughed up for a day permit and either ignored him, rode off or gave him verbal.
I felt compelled to stay and talk to him after that and smooth things over.

It does seem strange that in areas such as woborn or swinley where the trials are either built by locals or a volunteers group you have to pay to ride. Where as the welsh trial centres where there is alot of intevestment are free.

So basically your not paying for anything except to be on their land.

Well basically yes, it was to be some sort of insurance. Thing is if people had bothered to buy permits then perhaps things could have moved on.
At the end of the day it's private land, the Estate agreed to allow certain areas to be developed as long as bikers purchased permits to ride those areas. Clearly a lot people haven't bothered with permits and further to that they've developed outside of the agreed area, and to rub salt into it there have been some highly visible biking companies cough/bright orange banners/cough set up shop there.

Like it or not though it's his land. and as far as i know Swinley is part of the royal estate being in Windsor. I dont know about the trail centres springing up but they tend to be in areas of commercial or tourist interest so they attract people into the area and revenue is generated that way? Who comes to MK other than on business?

Wer'e trying to get something together to present to the estate, but it's early days.
There's no question of shutting all access down ROWs will remain ROWs.
The problem is it's private land and although there are user meetings the MTB fraternity is poorly represented, so the estate is really only hearing one side of the arguement.

I ride at Woburn regularly, how can I get involved in these meetings ?

I have a meeting with British Cycling this afternoon regarding mountain biking in and around the area so will see if it's anything they are aware of.

I'll find out for you, I take it your ReservoirGoats?
We used to have a great guy onboard that campaigned for us, I think he worked with Pat Adams on occassions and just seemed to get things done and keep everyone happy.
We have a lot of support and I think Woburn was even once approached to hold the Mountain Mayhem?
My own opinion is that the problem is 'claim culture' I might be wrong though.

As a relative newcomer to Woburn, I did not even know you needed a permit 😳

Which one would one need to ride Woburn? The Aspley Wood one or Oak Wood and Rammamere Heath, Stockgrove Country Park one?

How would you feel about someone digging big holes & building ramps in your back garden causing a damn eye sore without your permission.
The rangers are not unreasonable people, it fact I've found if you work with them they are very welcoming and tolerant of mountain bikers.
Buy your permits Ladies & Gentlemen. £11 for the year £2 a day or join one of the local MTB clubs who get a huge discount for their members. However way you add it up its a bargain for some of the best riding in the area.
Rant over 🙂

Old Git that tail of yours is terrible. I have to say when I was caught I bought a day permit.

Particularly as Chick sands cost more forless, but people do see to pay up there

Do we need Mouatin bikers to talk to mountain bikers so the jumpers understand the score.

My sister in law s part of the Leighton Buzzard cycling town so I'll ask her about it

I really hope this does not happen. I ride Woburn pretty much every Sunday and have done for years. There are some great trails there and really nice steep tecnical sections. I'd be gutted if they made it a "no bike zone", (except the bridleways). I buy my pass every year and often speak to the Ranger if he is a round the play area, (not that I ride the downhill stuff except for a few of the less extreme runs). I also make a conscious effort to greet everyone I meet, particularly walkers as I know there will always be some who are not keen on seeing bikes everywhere.

There has been lots of new runs built in the designated play area and I'm always impressed by the riders hardwork and efforts to build them. Also lots runs now have names and signs put up. Maybe its the increase in these new trails that has now caused a problem. One thing I must confess is that I don't really pay attention to the "no bike signs" on some path ways when riding round that our usual cycle route crosses.

I think the best option would be a dedicated trail, (like Follow the Dog at Cannock where I also ride frequently), but as said above this will cost money to build. I would however happily make a donation towards the costs if it meat I could keep my Sunday morning ride.

Chris

There has been pretty good co-exsistance for ages, the early trails just used to edge the official ROWs in fact some of them are so old that walkers think they are footpaths.
The new stuff is mainly in plantation and from what I've seen no damage has been caused, and at the end of the day the lot could be felled just as it was on the Tippy Trucker trail.

I ride Woburn most Tuesday nights and always buy the permit every year! I know last time I bought it there was talk they were going to increase the price due to alot of litter being left round by the jump site, we don't really ride the Jump park so can't comment on how bad it is but surely that don't help!

And anyone else notice a month or so back that loads of branches and obsticles were being put in the middle of the trails? Very dangerous, some people just don't think!! Obviously a bad tempered walker, shame cause like most riders up there we make an extra effort to be courteous and respectful when we approach people out walking!

oldgit

Anything I can do to help let me know?

Maybe worth getting a meeting together of all the local riders and maybe trying to get one of the National Cycling Bodies involved

Of course substantiating the rumours first before we all go off half cocked might be a plan

Ken
I've been passed this info by our old clubs ex secretary, and it appears from the email I received that it originates from a council cycling officer and there's a forward from a warden.
It could blow over and continue in this way for years I don't know.

Deffo an issue with the trails. So far (as I know) it hasn't gone any further than the County Council, the Greensand Trust who if I'm right are sub contracted by the county Council to look afetr the place and The Dukes Estates.

I've also learned today that the threat also extends to Horse and walking route and anything that isn't a ROW.

by trails do you mean the singletrack? dirt jumps? the mini dh stuff? or all of it?

In a word yes all of it excluding anything that is a recognized ROW.

Boing – any news on this?

Oldgit – hope you're not right. I would support a more formal arrangement to ride at Woburn and be prepared to pay for the priviledge as would all of the group i ride with. Those pathetic individuals who bitch about paying a paltry sum for access to some of the best riding for miles should go ride on the redways in MK. (that's supposed to be derogatory – idiots)

I for one would be lost without 'the woods' on a Sunday morning and although I haven't influence in cycling circles generally would be keen to help to keep access open to Woburn. Let me know what I can help with.